Speaker 0 00:00 Hi and welcome to the closeness podcast. My name is Tari and you're listening to part one of how to say no. Without a doubt. This is one of the most important subjects of our time. One of the first things I want to touch on here is that so often we get caught up on no means no exclusively in a sexual situation, and that's true. It does come up all the time in that regard, but it's not the only place where we hear the word no. We hear no and something as simple as asking someone for a favor or if they want to go somewhere to dinner tonight or what kind of food they're in the mood for. So right off the bat, I want to distinguish a line of severity when it comes down to proceeding forward with something sexual versus all other areas of life when we hear the word no.
Speaker 0 00:43 And I want to be clear that especially in intimate situations, that it absolutely goes without saying that when someone says no to you, it needs to be honored and respected, internalized, and acknowledged. And it doesn't mean you'll hear me say several times throughout this episode and the next one that it's a maybe or you can maybe change her mind or it's a time to insult the person or put them down there. No, of course needs to be honored and respected. The beautiful part about language, however, and being able to be empathetic and understanding and having a desire to explore something with someone is the ability to reach a better understanding of one another. And I'm hoping you'll agree that if we say no to someone, someone maybe who we know or at the very least as an acquaintance, I don't think that what we're all looking for is for that person to shut up, turn around and run away in the other direction and never talk to you again.
Speaker 0 01:35 That may be we can reach a place of understanding. It's not always appropriate, but in many cases it is. So I want to put out there that the way we handle ourselves, what comes next and what follows after we hear a no, or after we tell someone no is what makes all the difference in the world. I would think that if two people care about each other like each other or are interested in one another, that having a conversation about each other's feelings and why they feel a certain way, what's making them feel a certain way and gaining some understanding about why someone might be saying no right now is equally if not more valuable than simply hearing a no. Shutting everything down and changing the subject, running away, feeling awkward or uncomfortable leaving or what have you. Understanding is key. Now. There's nothing in me that wants to say that your personal boundaries or your know needs to be changed.
Speaker 0 02:29 You should never be made to feel like your wrong for feeling how you feel, but I do want to take a very deep dive into how to say no, how to receive no, how to hear no in a way that is supportive of the other person. Delivery and receipt to me is everything, both in sexual and nonsexual situations. If a woman asks me if she can kiss me and I say no, what? Then I for one, don't want her feel like she can never speak to me again or has to get super uncomfortable or thinks she'd get weird or awkward. She can even ask a followup question, but the way that she does it really matters. If she says something as simple as, Hmm, why not? Number one, she should be prepared for any answer that she might receive because you're opening yourself up to criticism and critique and asking that.
Speaker 0 03:24 Number two, I can give her an honest answer about how I'm feeling, but I also need to be aware of my tone and need to understand that someone is asking me to basically judge or criticize them in some way. They're asking me why they can't kiss me. Everyone needs to understand that that's basically someone asking or wanting to understand what another person finds unattractive about them so they can understand it and that's a big question. You always want to make sure you're prepared to hear any answer that might come your way. If you're going to ask a question like that. So when I give an honest and sincere answer to something like that, I really want my delivery to be as kind and also authentic as possible. And likewise, when she asks if the tone is accusatory, if she says something like, why not? What's wrong with you?
Speaker 0 04:12 Why wouldn't you want to? Or it's somehow feels a little threatening. That changes the entire conversation. I've always been a big fan of direct and honest communication, but there's a difference between those in the world who think that they don't sugar coat, they just give it to you blunt, they lay it out the way it is. They're a real straight shooter. They can't stand pussyfooting around the subject and they just speak freely without any care or consideration for who you are. The delivery and the way those types of comments almost invariably come out are very insulting, very hurtful and very offensive to most people. And people who feel that level of boldness or intensity or being brash or brazen often wind up hurting people's feelings and then not caring because they think that they should be able to hear it or handle it often because that's what dad did or that's how they grew up and they don't realize how many people they're hurting.
Speaker 0 05:05 I don't think that's a great approach at all, but I also don't think it's a great approach to pretend that something's not true. We really sugar coat to be over accommodating to be over the top kind and try to show that you really are a good person to people that over compromising can get you into trouble as well. I think the middle ground works really well and I think it's an okay thing to say. I'm not feeling attracted to you or I just am not attracted to you. I don't find an attraction here. I don't feel chemistry, any number of things that express disinterest as long as it's done in a polite, friendly, courteous, but not spiteful way. I find that in the media and when we all discuss it, for the most part, an enormous spotlight is shined on what happens when a woman is telling a man no in a very explicit sexual situation.
Speaker 0 05:54 Of course the consensus is no means no. Everything gets shut down right then and there, but we don't know where to go from there and no one ever talks about what's on the other side of that, which is how do you respond? How do you interact with someone once you hear their no or their boundary, and that's what this episode is all about, why does the exploration of it or the understanding of it just stop right there and no one knows what to do next? We're going to explore that profoundly, but saying no is not simply about a sexual encounter. It happens millions of times a day between men and women, both sexes telling each other no consistently. I've even heard terrible stories about women who don't take no well or who feel horribly rejected or who authentically freak out about being turned down or someone not wanting to have sex with them or how they handle rejection.
Speaker 0 06:44 So it's a really big subject. We all have to be aware about how we say no, how we receive it and our delivery of it. We're going to handle this subject very carefully and with a great deal of respect, but I also invite you to have an open mind and to not be part of the masses who often just have a knee jerk response. I don't like that. I like this. This is right. That's wrong. We put everything into a little box because that's what you've heard or that's what you've always known. Generally, voices like that come from a place of severe judgment as if they know all they can do no wrong, and they've done no wrong in their past. We've all made mistakes in the past. We've all been wrong. For instance, has your mind ever changed? Have you ever said yes, but meant no or vice versa?
Speaker 0 07:29 Have you ever just decided that you want something else? Of course you have. So to get things started, let's talk briefly about our internal guidance system. You may also know this as your instinct or your gut. To begin, we're going to start speaking about rejection before we jump in. However, if you live somewhere like the streets of New York, the Bronx, or you're taking a subway every day, you're on the underground, you're bumping into people right and left, everyone's in your face. I understand you've got boundaries, walls. Sometimes you don't even want to look at people. You don't have the time of day to acknowledge everyone. Say hello, be friendly and cordial and you certainly don't have the space. I get it, but the examples that I want to use for when we're dealing with how to say no to someone have to do with you feeling safe already.
Speaker 0 08:16 When you're in an environment that's very natural, whether it's a park or a store, it could be a yoga studio or a work event or a friendly party. As we're exploring our internal guidance system. Keep that in mind that we're talking about someplace it feels comfortable to you. For most of the world, people who feel well calibrated or tuned in to their higher self, they know who they are or they're used to listening to their body, our gut, our instincts serves us. It gives us an instant sensation about whether we should or shouldn't do something. Now, this only goes so far and I need to get this out of the way as well. You wouldn't want your surgeon to exclusively rely on his instinct and gut to make all choices when it comes to an operation with you. You wouldn't want him to throw his education to the wind, right?
Speaker 0 09:03 You wouldn't want your doctor or lawyer or someone who makes critical decisions for you to say, well, I exclusively relied on my instinct to figure this out. Often, it's a combination of our best understanding of the world and our instinct and our internal guidance system. The other premise I'd like to lay out with regard to this is that when something isn't right for you or your have a feeling that it's wrong, that you don't believe this is globally wrong or wrong for everyone or even wrong for you forevermore, something that you don't have a good feeling about something where you're having an intuition that's telling you no does not mean as bad for the whole world. It doesn't even mean it's bad for your friends or family. It's simply means that in this moment, something about what you're feeling is not lining up and so therefore it's not a good choice for you right now.
Speaker 0 09:53 It doesn't even mean later on tonight. It might not be a good choice, but it's important to honor your feelings in that regard. Now, all of that being said, you generally know right away within a second when someone approaches you, if you're interested in speaking to them or not, or if you're attracted to them or not to bolster. On top of that, I want to add another simple idea. Most of us know that good feels good and something that's bad feels bad to us. We feel it inside. So sometimes when making a decision, it's about tuning into what your body needs or your gut says and making a choice based on what feels best to you. A very simple way to illustrate your gut working properly would be imagine that you are in a department store like Nordstrom's and you're with a girlfriend and you guys are shopping together out of the blue.
Speaker 0 10:41 This girlfriend suggests that you should try to steal as much jewelry as possible in broad daylight right under the noses of the salespeople. Now, I'm pretty sure that if you thought she was serious for 99.99% of us, we get a very strange feeling in our stomach that would tell us no, that does not feel right. Even if it's something you might be curious about doing, you certainly wouldn't want to face the repercussions of doing it. So fear is going to stop you, but law's going to stop you. Knowing that it's wrong is going to stop you. Knowing that people just don't do things like this and all number of other reasons, but most importantly, you're going to feel that in the pit of your stomach or in your chest. It's just doesn't feel right. That discomfort, that's your internal guidance system telling you, no, this isn't right.
Speaker 0 11:28 This doesn't work for me. On the other hand, if you're with that same girlfriend and out of the blue, she says, Hey, I did really well at work this week. I would love to treat you to an incredible spa treatment, a massage. I've already reserved it. They've got Reiki. We're going to do dinner afterwards. It comes with the ability to play around in the jacuzzi and swim all day. We're going to be in the sun. It's going to be great. If you've got nothing else going, would you like to join me? And for most people that should feel like a resounding yes inside. There's nothing bad about it. It feels good. It feels right. Good feels good, bad, feels bad, and you can tell in any position, any moment, anytime of day how you're feeling or how you're lined up with your connection to yourself by how good or bad you're feeling.
Speaker 0 12:15 Now, something we could dive into for hours but we're not going to explore in this episode is how to tell the difference between your gut and instinct on one side and your fear or your religious upbringing or the way you were raised by your parents interfering with what you actually might want for yourself. Because sometimes the ladder makes you feel a negative response about things, but it's not actually bad for you and you might actually enjoy the experience. But I don't want to convolute too much here. Sometimes we get a negative feeling or some form of negative emotion and we say to ourselves, I don't have a good feeling about this. I don't like this. I don't want to move forward. If you're getting that kind of feeling or sensation, I always encourage people to listen to that, to not move forward and to not go through with it even if you don't understand it.
Speaker 0 13:06 And even if you think it's unfounded because you don't want to find yourself in an uncomfortable situation, sometimes you're on the fence about making a decision. Ah, should I should NY? I see the pluses. I see the minuses. I could, I couldn't. I'm open to either. Even though you can find the silver lining in anything, I will often encourage people who don't know themselves well or who may be, are a little more fearful or who don't like find themselves in bad situations, don't do things that aren't a hell yes. Don't go to events or parties, don't accept invitations to things that don't make you feel like you really want to do them. At the end of the day, of course you can do whatever you want, but tuning into yourself in this way almost guarantees that you're going to have a happy, joyous experience at the other end of your decision and a reminder, these things that you're saying no to, it's not that they're globally wrong or bad or wrong or bad for anyone else or even you later.
Speaker 0 14:05 It's just something worth listening to in the moment. So given all of that and everything you've understood so far, here's a question for you. Why do we have such a difficult time saying no when something doesn't feel good? No, I'm not interested. No, this doesn't work for me. No, not that, but yes, this, no, that makes me feel funny now I'm embarrassed to do it. I don't want to do it. No is such a simple phrase. It's simply two letters. It's so short and effective, but more often than not, we use a different word, especially when we don't want the other person to be upset or to hurt their feelings. We tell ourselves all the time, so therefore instead of saying no, instead of being direct and honest, we say maybe in the arena of dating and sexuality maybe does not mean no. Maybe means yes.
Speaker 0 15:04 Sure. It sounds pretty good. I think I'm very interested, but I haven't decided if I really want to yet. Maybe means I'm torn between two choices. Maybe could mean I'm not feeling so great, so I want to feel into it and I'll decide soon. Or at the very least it means, I don't know. I'm thinking about it. I might want to, there are an incredible number of things that may be, can mean may be, I will in case you've never heard the definition of maybe before it means possibly and perhaps, but you might've noticed that nowhere contained within the definition of maybe is the word. No, no, I don't want to know. I'm not going to know. I will not. Maybe sounds like yes but maybe another time or yes, but I just need a little more convincing or yes. But let me see what else I have going on first.
Speaker 0 15:56 Cause you know I have a very busy schedule. Maybe does not mean no, I'm not interested and whoever's speaking to you should just run away and never speak to you again. I really do my best to stay away from polarizing gender roles such as all men do this and all men do that. But I think for the purpose of this podcast though, it's going to be useful to keep in mind that in our part of the world, for the most part, men are required and expected to pursue women. Yes, I know there are exceptions. I know you've got that one girlfriend who just runs up to guys all the time and says, Hey, you're really hot. I'd love to meet you and spend some time with you. But as a general rule, most of the time, if you're honest with yourself, a woman is expecting a man to approach her, especially when women consider themselves to be beautiful women or hot commodities or very desirable or high status.
Speaker 0 16:50 You certainly don't see them running around chasing after other men. And in fact, for the most part, they don't have to. Almost no woman has to do any of that without plenty of men coming to her on their own. And I think that point that I just brought up here, it's useful to not point out the one and only example you know in your life to try to prove another point wrong. Oh, I know someone who does this or I have this one friend who does it, so therefore the whole argument's wrong. I think it's important to not negate examples where the vast majority of the world is operating a certain way. So we're making generalizations but appropriate ones to not negate it by saying, well, there's one or two people who don't do it that way, so therefore it's not true. I know exceptions exist, of course, they always do and I'm thrilled that they do.
Speaker 0 17:36 It gives me hope for the rest of the world, but I really think it's okay to speak about the majority in terms of truth and what we find when it comes to dating is that the majority of women want to be pursued, want to be chased, want attention, want to be desired. Everything is moving in one direction. She might do things to make herself more appealing or approachable or desirable or the opposite, but you generally don't see her hunting. In fact, some women even tie in their entire self worth based upon the amount of attention they're getting or how many people approach them or how many likes they get. Now, if you happen to not be one of these women or you're in a happy, committed relationship where you want none of that, that's great. But I don't think it's too far of a stretch or a hard sell at all to say men must do most of the aggressing when it comes to pursuing women for intimacy, dating relationships and procreation.
Speaker 0 18:34 And I think more often than not, women are doing something to be receptive. They're being open to the advances or making themselves available to be seen or flirted with or spoken to, or mid love too. So what are some things women do to make themselves available? Eye contact. Being cute or cutesy, being girly, flirting, playing with their hair, standing in a certain way, standing close to men, being open or receptive to a conversation, some physical contact, putting their hand on the shoulder of someone that they like, or the leg or the arm or other more intimate places. The uncomplimentary staying in the same place with a man or going to a new place with him. Continuing to stay engaged in the conversation. But it's rare that you see a woman say, we should trade numbers and hang out. We need to get together. I would like to pursue you or you're so sexy.
Speaker 0 19:31 I want more of this. Or whatever type of flirtatious comment that says, yo, I need to get some of this. And because I know some of you are still saying, I do that, I do that, I do that. Do you then reach out and do you reach out more than once? Will you actually text the person and say more than it was nice to meet you? It's great to see you. Will you pursue and move a conversation forward, move intimacy forward? Will you make the first move with the man? Will you continue to do that? And I think at a certain point very early on, most women reach a very solid no. It's pretty rare to see women communicate with men with very overt direct communication verbally and directly coming onto a man and putting herself at total risk for rejection. Some examples of direct communication might be, I like you, I think you're hot.
Speaker 0 20:23 I want to spend more time with you. What's your phone number? How and when can we see each other again? How can we make something happen? The kind of comments where there's no mistake that that woman is sexually or romantically interested. Now I know these are some strong thoughts and I'm sure, again, examples exists where you don't think that's true, but I think if we look at the norm, this is how it tends to go in the world. If you're still a little skeptical, imagine you're thumbing through a magazine and you're noticing some of the models in that magazine, they don't have to be models, and this really could be any woman, but just illustrate a point. You could even make it extreme by saying Victoria's secret model if you want, but pick any women in a magazine who sort of posing. Imagine one of those girls at a cocktail party or a social gathering or a nightclub going from man to man approaching cold opening, vying for attention and making direct over gestures that she would like to either get to know them or sleep with them or be with them effectively.
Speaker 0 21:22 All of the same behavior that you're used to having men do to you. Can you imagine her doing incredibly unnecessary favors such as begging man for the opportunity? Hey, can I get you into this other club later? Hey, can we get together next week and I take you to Hawaii? Hey, would you like to drive my car later tonight? Q. Imagine her texting another guy five times in a row. Please come over and watch Netflix with me. Can you imagine a woman stopping a man on the street and saying, Hey, it looks like you're really cold out here waiting in this really long line to get in. Can I get you in for free? Do you want to spend the evening with me? The big point of all this, the whole point being is that women seldom are in a position where they have to face the one thing that they consistently give to other men in a very poor way.
Speaker 0 22:08 They never have to face rejection. Never is way too strong of a word I know rarely have to face rejection. When it comes to intimacy and dating, it happens. Yes, you don't always get the guy you want, but overwhelmingly you're never in a position to be rejected. Overwhelmingly, women don't do rejection and so doesn't it then make sense that if women are doing all of the rejecting and very rarely experiencing rejection or fear, rejection, hate, rejection, can't stand the feeling, as I often say, they don't want to dip their pinky toe into the well of rejection. Now certainly there may be times as a woman where you feel like you're being rejected or you feel slighted or you feel like you weren't chosen. But I'm talking about very specific situations when someone approaches you and you have to reject them or vice versa. So does it then make sense that maybe women aren't very well equipped when giving rejection or being the one who's doing the rejecting?
Speaker 0 23:08 If you're accustomed to rejecting men a hundred times a day, it doesn't mean you're good at it. It just means you've developed systems to shut it all down. And yet there are all these unspoken rules that so many women have amongst their circles of friends and girlfriends about exactly what a man is supposed to do when he approaches you supposed to say the right amount of aggression and dominance, the understanding when she's not interested, you hear women say he just doesn't get it. What is it that he's not getting? You want us to understand what we're supposed to be getting without you having to say it. So many things that are done where women expect men to know. And also so many things that women do to never put themselves in a position of being rejected. Sometimes a man can make one comment and that comment sits with a woman the wrong way.
Speaker 0 24:03 And that one sentence can sit with her for weeks, months, sometimes years. It just eats and eats and eats away at her. You said two years ago that you dot, dot, dot, and sometimes that comment never gets forgiven. It never gets forgotten. And that is the power of rejection on women, unfortunately. So if you as a woman have ever been hurt or felt rejected by another man or woman, consider what another man might be feeling when he's experiencing your rejection. You blow him off or your haphazardly or inadvertently just shutting him down. So to tie it all together, we really need to look at these dynamics when we're talking about how to say no, because if all the women are doing the rejecting for the most part and all the men are doing the pursuing, but women don't know how to reject men. Men don't know how to receive rejection.
Speaker 0 24:59 Women sometimes send mixed signals. Women sometimes of course changed their mind. Women sometimes act as if they're interested, but they're not, or vice versa. There's a lot to unpack here. I stand strongly behind the belief that there should be accountability for how someone lets you down, how they reject you, the words they use and the attitude and emotion behind it. Just like men should be respectful toward women when they get rejected. Women often have the expectation that a man should take rejection like a man or take it easily or not be upset or bothered when she rejects him. Women want to be treated with respect. They want men to have good manners around them when they approach and also when they reject them. So two, I really firmly believe that there's a moral obligation to be a better person. If by the way things work, you are only going to be pursued.
Speaker 0 25:52 If you've chosen to say, I'm not going to pursue men, I'm only gonna let them come to me to then have some manners about how you go about rejecting and how you say no, especially since the way the world is set up is that if we want to interact with you, we have to approach you. We don't know your background. We don't know if you're just fresh out of a relationship or if you're married or if you're happily involved with someone else. We see you, we find you deeply attractive and we want to connect in some way. And so we try and many men have very unresourceful horrible ways of going about doing that. Screaming, whistling, hollering, touching you without permission and all that and others have more classy ways like just trying to politely speak to you. However, if we have to do all of the approaching because you don't want to do any of it because you're scared of it and you don't want to be rejected, you don't want to be insulted or hurt or turned down or maybe you can't take it.
Speaker 0 26:49 Well hear this. We are the ones taking all of the risk. At the very least, there should be consideration and a standard for how you go about letting people down. So said differently. When you say no to someone, if you would like to feel cared for, respected and honored, then your delivery of how you turn someone down should match it. When you brush someone off, when you're rolling your eyes, when you're not giving him the time of day, when you start to act extremely uncomfortable, even though it's a very comfortable social setting, or maybe you do start to feel uncomfortable when you pretend you have a phone call or pretend you have a boyfriend or you're not deeply honest about what's going on. When you pretend you didn't hear him say hello, when you pretend you didn't hear him say goodbye. All of these little things feel like slights to a man and they give him either anxiety or discomfort and for some people anger.
Speaker 0 27:44 It's not a healthy way to go about rejecting someone. And of course for men on the other side or whoever is being rejected. Yeah, of course you don't want to hold on to things. You don't want to take it personally. When someone's rejecting you, it's not necessary to let it fester or sit with you for many months as you begin to experience rejection more and more. You do want to toughen your skin to some regard and yes, the more rejection you receive in the worst kinds you get. I guess the more you could get used to it, but that still doesn't make it okay in my opinion, to treat someone poorly when they have interest in you and they're going about it in a friendly or classy or respectful or very sweet or even shy way.
Speaker 0 28:25 When you take something personally or something hurts you, for the most part, you're only feeling that hurt because it resonates with you on some level. In other words, you find it in some way to be true. If someone told me I'm a disgusting, horrible, terrible, repulsive skydiver and I should be humiliated by my ability and I should never show my face in these friendly skies again, what effect is that going to have on me? I've never even been skydiving before. I don't even have an interest in doing it, so how could I take it personally? Really? How can I be offended by something that's not relevant and not pertinent to me? But if it's something that strikes a chord with you, if it's something that you're already feeling uncomfortable and secure about on the inside, say for example, I decide to wear an old button down shirt and I can't tell if it really looks good on me or not.
Speaker 0 29:18 I'm wondering if I should give it away. I don't feel super sexy in it, but I decided to wear it anyway and then maybe I feel like a few people are looking funny at me today and one outspoken friend decides to say to me, you know, it's nice to see you today, but that shirt, it's <inaudible>. It's not the best on you. I've seen better. Well now of course it's going to activate something in me. There's some truth in it. I was already feeling that way myself and that's the very thing that makes rejection hurt is we have a piece of ourselves invested in it, but you have absolutely no control over the things that you are attracted to. If you think a little rabbit or a squirrel or a deer is gorgeous, or you think an elephant or tiger is a beautiful animal, did you really choose to feel that way?
Speaker 0 30:01 Did you at one point think D's are disgusting, repulsive animals, and then later change your mind to find them attractive? Did you even have a say so in the matter as to whether you found these animals to be beautiful beings or not? Of course not. Same thing with the ocean, with the mountains and same thing with people. You find who you find attractive and you don't have control over that, and to me that's what's going on. When you hear someone say, it's not about you, it's about them. No one has any control over whether they find you attractive or not.
Speaker 0 30:34 Interestingly, there's a caveat that seems to not hold true in the cases of many women who didn't think that they were physically attracted to their man in the beginning and then suddenly without explanation qualities about that man began to grow on them, how sweet he was or cuddly or how much he helps others or his drive or his mission or purpose in life or the way he treats his children. Some of these things speak so profoundly to women and so that attraction can shift over time, but for the most part, again, you don't really have control over that happening. Things can get pretty bad if you have a lack of worthiness or feel a lot of shame or you have a lot of self hatred, you don't think you're worth it. Then you might find oftentimes people's negative comments line up with exactly how you feel about yourself and then it feels very offensive that someone would've said something that matches how you feel already. So we are talking about how to say no, but we really have to understand what rejection really is and what hearing no is all about is in fact rejection.
Speaker 0 31:41 Sometimes as a man, it feels like a double edged sword because we're the ones who have to put ourselves out there, but at the same time we don't know what's waiting for us. On the other side, we know nothing about you. If you're single, if you're married, if you've got a boyfriend, if you're feeling emotional today or upset or not in the mood to speak to anyone or you're looking for a warm connection or you're looking for something intimate or you're looking to find your next husband, you may have a boyfriend, but we don't know if everything is going incredibly well with the boyfriend and you're feeling super happy and connected to him. Or if you're just on the verge of a breakup, which by the way is most women, so many women are seeing someone right now. The truth is, yes, they technically have a boyfriend, but are they satisfied?
Speaker 0 32:23 Are they in love? Is it a mutually delicious relationship? Are you getting what you want from it? And I'm not saying that therefore you should break up or cheat or even give someone else the time of day who is trying to hit on you. But most people are not in a perfect relationship or a happy relationship. Even when they say they're involved, someone that are constantly annoyed or upset or bothered by the person that they're dating and they're really ready to get out, but they stay in it for whatever reason. We don't know if you filed for divorce or ready for divorce or would like to have one. We don't know if you are emotionally upset or hurt. There's no way for us to know if you're in an open relationship or if you can't stand men for whatever reason. In some no one walks around with a tag on your chest letting us know your status and your emotional availability.
Speaker 0 33:07 Instead, we have to do what? What's the only thing that we can do? We have to engage you, initiate with you, find out, connect, talk to you, make some sort of comment. We've got to get past those first 30 45 seconds of tension and discomfort to figure out what's going on with you. Where do you stand, what are you open to and available for? So even though there are many men who do it poorly, can you really fault men for doing the aggressing or doing the opening and engaging? There's actually no formal education for this sort of thing. Boys are copying other boys. Boys are copying their dad, boys are copying porn or they saw something work for one person they think is going to work for another. How do we really know what you need? And here's the thing, we as a gender do what we like.
Speaker 0 34:00 Women do, what they like and what they think they'd want to have done to them. Men do what we like. That's why most men are genital focused because we're more excited by someone who reaches in and turns us on just by going right for the goods. Whereas women, as I often say, warm up from the outside in and it's actually quite unnatural for all people to try to do what's completely unnatural to us. When it comes to rejecting someone in saying no, everything changes. If someone is treating you poorly, disrespecting you, not honoring your boundaries or your space, then of course by all means take action, establish boundaries, give a more direct and sharp or harsh response. It's very understandable why you might be cold or distant or ignore someone who's being rude or inconsiderate to you, but if you're the type of girl who has someone approaching you on a regular basis with a lot of people who really are doing their best, because let's face it, if they could do better or they knew a better way to get to your heart, mind, body, soul, don't you think they would do it?
Speaker 0 35:01 They're trying to find a way to get to know you, to spend time with you, to ask you out. Imagine you want to do this for a man and how silly you would get, how awkward you would feel, how uncomfortable it feels to have to say anything that involves putting yourself out there on the line for a man that you're really into, only for him to possibly reject you, and the risk is pretty high, especially for men. If you think a man should be doing something differently, I invite you to try approaching 10 men all on your own at a mall or a market or someplace where you feel completely safe and it's in public. But the thing is you can only pick people who you're really attracted to, someone who physically takes your breath away. Even if you're not a very physical person, someone who makes you say, wow, it makes me uncomfortable to imagine going up to him because I find him so attractive.
Speaker 0 35:50 If he makes you a little nervous when you look at him, try approaching that man and see what happens. Ask him if he'd like to spend some time with you, maybe be intimate with you or get to know you over coffee. But the harsh reality of this is is that something like this can never really play out the way we would hope for too, because men are far more receptive to dropping anything they're doing and start spending time with a girl who they might be remotely sexually attracted to, especially if they're just kind of cute or pretty attractive or have a attribute that they might really enjoy looking at. So he'll probably say yes and it'll be very difficult for you to experience that. All important rejection. But approaching someone takes some real confidence. It doesn't mean you can just stand close by or flip your hair about your eyes.
Speaker 0 36:36 Approaching someone is not about doing something that gets the man's attention so that he then comes and is confidently dominant or assertive with you. So it's not about receptivity or being available for advances. Approaching means walking up to someone with eye contact, giving him your best shot, your line, your compliment or thoughtful idea. The one thing your interaction hinges on before you go running off in the other direction and see how long you can keep your ground. If you think you can handle all that, try letting him know that you have romantic, intimate or sexual intentions and see how it goes. Of course, I can't speak for everyone on the planet and exceptions exist by the handful, but I am pretty sure when I say almost all women would pretty much prefer not to be doing this or not be put in this situation, which is interesting because it would give you guys so much choice, so much selection, so much ability to have whatever you want rather than defaulting to the loudest guy in the room and the most obnoxious guy who managed to muster up the strength to talk to you.
Speaker 0 37:38 If you are someone who approaches, if you have no problem saying, Hey, do you have Instagram? Can we stay in touch? And you think this stuff is easy for you. Consider taking it to the next level. Consider how it feels to then reach out to the person that you like and say, Hey, it's Larissa. We met earlier today and I was wondering if you wanted to come to this concert with me or grab a bite to eat with me or go to coffee with me and just notice what it takes to be able to do that and the kind of response that you would like in return. Can you imagine if a man scoffed at you go out with you? Come on. No, no, I don't want to do that. Or Oh please, I have a girlfriend. I'm gay. I'm here with my male friends. And then never said anything else or just used one and two word replies, no thanks. Can't busy.
Speaker 0 38:35 If it took you a lot to get the nerve up to speak to someone, to interact with him, to connect with him in some way and all he was able to give you was these types of brush offs, how would it feel? So it's very challenging work. I might even be so bold as to say, I don't think I've physically been anywhere where I've seen another woman truly cold, open, initiate with engage another guy just out of the blue, a perfect stranger where she's gone up and made direct sexual, romantic or sensual intention, super clear on her own where she might stick around or linger until she gets what she wants, the phone number, the kiss or the intimate interaction, whatever it is. Now, to be fair, I feel lucky enough to be someone who has had that happened to him before. The times where a woman has done that with me, I've loved it.
Speaker 0 39:23 I think it's an incredible feeling to experience, to see her get nervous or uncomfortable or to have her say, Oh my gosh, you make me feel so nervous and excited at the same time. I think all of those emotions are really good for a woman to feel, not because I want to feel uncomfortable, but feeling on the edge of excitement and nervousness and not knowing what's going to happen. Isn't that so much more attractive for a woman to be feeling those emotions rather than the guy she likes. Do you like the idea of a man who is interested in you feeling wishy-washy, nervous, super angsty or anxious? Yes. Sometimes you'll find it cute, but do you find it deeply sexually attractive? That's why I think it's nice when women do the approaching and they do the initiating because number one, they get to see what it feels like and number two, because there's something highly erotic about her turning herself into a nervous puddle.
Speaker 0 40:17 For instance, I'd love to share a very sweet example of this from my past many, many years ago, once I was in Hawaii with my family and we happened to be in a beautiful resort at Princeville, the lobby gave way to the restaurant by taking down some marble stairs and it had an entire view of the ocean right in front of you is absolutely gorgeous and much the way you see a beautiful woman come down the stairs when she's ready for prom and then locks eyes with the man downstairs who's like captivated by her. This was a bit of a reverse situation where I was feeling that I was all dressed up in linen back in the day and collarless button down shirts and I remember locking eyes with a girl as I was slowly walking down the stairs and we held eye contact as I was walking down and I could see that she was a bit <inaudible> interested and I think full of some desire and curiosity.
Speaker 0 41:06 So he held eyes for quite some time, but she was with her family and I was with mine and there wasn't a whole lot to be done. Well, once we were seated with our menus and we were talking and looking over the menu, deciding what we want for dinner, I all of a sudden noticed a woman's hand to my right holding an exquisite Hawaiian flower. It was one of those bright, vivid, almost plastic looking flowers. She put it right next to me and she said, this is for the most handsome man in the room. This is for you. Wow. My jaw was on the floor. I was so moved and so touched, so taken back and I wanted to show my appreciation so much in some way and make her feel comfortable and safe. But before I could even say anything, she had turned around quickly and walked all the way back to her seat.
Speaker 0 41:57 And this perfectly exemplifies what we're talking about here, that fear of rejection, that fear of even lingering just for a moment to see what I might say or how I might respond. So I didn't even have the opportunity in that exact moment, but I was absolutely blown away at her confidence and her ability to approach an entire table like that. That is hard to do. But I loved that it was such a powerful gesture. She approached, she made the first move. It was a powerful compliment and then she vanished. The way I would describe her behavior is giving someone the signal that was a very clear, bold signal, but now it falls on you or me to do the rest. The leading, the approaching, the follow through and possibly even need sensual or sexual overtures. Actually approaching and following something through until you get what you want.
Speaker 0 42:48 Whatever it is, a conversation in an interaction or a date or even getting to know someone so you can eventually marry them. That takes a lot of pursuing. When you make yourself open and receptive, you can ask yourself if you think that's what the feminine role is or what being a woman is all about. Being open and receptive to another person's advances versus trying to move the entire thing forward yourself. For me personally, I infinitely prefer a woman approaching me this way. Making some very obvious gesture that lets me know I have full permission to move forward with her as opposed to some of the other stuff you see off in the distance. Batting her eyes, playing with her hair, clicking her heels, laughing hysterically, trying to stand near me and trying to Telegraph some sort of clandestine signal. This is so clear and then it lets a man pick up the Slack.
Speaker 0 43:42 But back to the story. In this particular situation it did fall on me to do the approaching and you better believe I did. Only a moment went by before my mother's boyfriend was nudging me to go over there and talk to her and approach her, and so I did with very favorable results. We were able to spend a couple evenings together in her hotel room under the stars, completely enjoying what Hawaii is all about and to not leave you hanging. Interestingly, we didn't have sex. Not only was she so powerful in her approach, she was also very powerful with what she wanted with her boundary and she wanted company intimacy, companionship, someone to cuddle with and play with and maybe kiss a little bit, someone to just feel connected to. It was a really beautiful couple of evenings and things like this just aren't the norm. I mean, to this day my mother still remembers this girl's name and we never had any contact outside of Hawaii. Her name was Jasmine.
Speaker 0 44:39 When it comes to approaching the opposite sex of the same sex, what kind of person are you? Are you someone who's assertive? Do you just linger and do you just hope the right person comes your way and talks to you? Do you get so much attention every single day that you don't even try with anyone that you might actually like or are you someone who does things to go get what you want as you're giving thought to some of these things? What about the times where you've rejected someone hastily or in a very poor fashion? The times that you've been short, cold, mean, dismissive, bitchy or rude, has the result been favorable for you? If you have experience with rejecting someone with kindness or love or sweetness, how has that gone for you?
Speaker 0 45:27 It's my hope that the men who you've rejected sweetly and with compassion are also friendly and sweet back to you, especially if you've been clear with them and you've thanked them for their time. We're all responsible for how we interact with one another. It's not about making women wrong or men wrong or assigning fault to anyone. We both have to change our ways of interacting with one another if we want to be happy. Sadly, so many of us are running around every day feeling so wounded. We haven't given ourselves time to heal from a previous loss or relationship before sleeping with someone else or getting on a dating website. We haven't healed from the last bad sexual experience or toxic breakup and it's really important to give ourselves time to process all of that.
Speaker 0 46:11 If we now take a look at the specific moment of a man trying to move things forward with you sexually, intimately and it's the very first time this is happening, it's critically important to remember and keep a few things in mind. Number one, words are only half of the equation. Body language is also extremely important. How she's sitting, if she's crossing her arms the way she's looking at us, the way her eyes are focused on us. Does she look scared or fearful? Does her face look inviting and do her eyes light up when she sees you? Is she engaged with what you're saying and doing? It's critical in these beginning moments when you're getting to know a girl to pay attention to what's happening and use that as information to back up if necessary or slow down or take it easy. If that's not an issue in fear or concern, isn't there?
Speaker 0 47:00 Then of course we want to keep her excited with you. Interested in you. We were talking earlier about how when we meet someone for the first time, no one's wearing a name tag that describes their background and that's especially true when it comes to a previous history of say, sexual abuse, violence or rape here more than ever, there's no way for us to know if our own behavior can activate post traumatic stress syndrome in them. There's no way for us to know if something we say is going to cause to have an episode of some sort or a breakdown or break down into tears and cry. So both people have to be really aware and men especially to be very sympathetic and empathetic and respectful towards this possibility. If you're a super fun person or you like to have a lot of fun or you're kind of in your college years, your early twenties and it's all about going out and partying and having fun, you might have had countless experiences where everything seems like it's fine.
Speaker 0 47:55 And then if you keep acting as if everything is going to work out the same way with each woman, you're going to wind up coming across people who have been seriously wounded, who don't operate that way or who don't share those same belief systems. It's going to create a problem. So having this receptivity I think is critical. And how do we do all of that without giving up on being men, being masculine, and doing all of the things that women love and adore about our very nature, our ability to make decisions, to take charge, to point out the way our intensity, our aggressiveness, our confidence, our ability to move inside of you and Pierce you with our gaze. Our ability to take control and take the lead so that you can relax into us being aggressive, dominant forward, leading, assertive, taking you, giving you an incredible experience, having our way with you if that's what you like, you want to experience all of that while still being sensitive to all the rest.
Speaker 0 48:55 That's the balance that we're trying to strike. So the tricky part about all this stuff is that when we're meeting someone for the first time, all of these exciting things can kind of take a back seat to the risk of rejection. How do you actually let someone down in a healthy conscious way? I think that letting people down properly will actually increase your sexual health. I think it can increase your desirability from men and increase your happiness and wellbeing and safety in your own life. To me, part of the reason why everyone is so afraid to be hurt, so afraid to be heard and why everyone is so aggressive is due to how we treat one another when we're not actually interested. And you know, I'll tell you a story to illustrate this point, but it gets really difficult when women have so much access.
Speaker 0 49:48 You have options like you never dreamed possible. Even if you don't consider yourself to be an attractive or healthy or fit woman, you know, or you should know and if you don't know, all you have to do is open your door that men want to have sex with you all the time, including men who want to do you favors and take you places and buy things for you, et cetera. If you don't know that and you're single and you feel like you need to know that, hop on any dating app or don't because the dating arena online is really kind of a nasty place. You'll see in future episodes. I'll do like the 40 deadly sins of online dating and there's a lot to unpack. But the point I'm driving home is that women have access and choice like never before. And so I can imagine it's difficult to reject each person lovingly and respectfully and sweetly when you have so much abundance.
Speaker 0 50:38 So there was a time a couple of years ago when I was dating a girl from Uzbekistan, which is an Eastern Europe. We had such an incredible sexual connection, but she had also showed me that she was on Tinder. And so I said, Hey, just out of curiosity, can I take a look at your matches her, I don't even know where to begin. I scrolled and scrolled and scrolled and scrolled. I mean, there must have been 400 plus open conversations if you've ever used online dating before. There's like the people who you're actually matched with and talking to. And then there's people who you matched with but no one's initiated conversation. So then I took my finger and scrolled across the top of the screen through hundreds and hundreds more men who said yes to her. I mean that's the level of access that many women have. And that's just normal. If you take a look at an average man's inbox, it looks nothing like that.
Speaker 0 51:32 So if we want to have any type of success at having a family, starting a relationship, having sex, once again as men, we need to approach. I've got another male friend who for all intents and purposes is absolutely gorgeous. Almost any woman alive finds him to be a beautiful specimen of a man. I mean, he's six foot something. He's built out muscular, actually have a couple of friends like this, broad shoulders, great smile, dresses well knows how to carry himself, walks like a model. And I see constantly women looking at them. I almost see them Swoon. I almost see them, ah, get a little tipsy or high just by looking at a man who has these dimensions or these physical appearances. And even though I've seen right before my eyes, I've watched women melt when they come across a man like this. Number one, I don't see women approach.
Speaker 0 52:22 I don't see them stop what they're doing and say, Hey, can I get your number? Can we talk? How do I talk more to you? And number two, I even see them get upset. They get angry at him for not approaching them. Multiple occasions he's had women approach him and say, I'm really pissed. I sat there, I waited for you. I waited and waited and waited and you did nothing. What the hell? And that in itself is a bit of a backhanded approach in the part of a woman, isn't it? So let's talk about rejecting men for a little while. Are you the kind of person who when you reject a man, you ignore texts, ignore phone calls, do you allow men to think that things are going somewhere but they actually aren't? Do you start talking to a man and then just randomly vanish forever?
Speaker 0 53:10 I can't begin to tell you how many stories I've got from men who have dated women where things seem to be going great. Whether you've had sex already or spent some time together or even are just starting out and then she's just gone with no explanation. Just a hundred percent vanished. Do you do this horrible thing called ghosting, which is hard to imagine. There's even a name for something like this because it's so popular, if you're not familiar with a ghosting is it's an incredibly toxic behavior where whenever you set a date with someone or plan to meet someone somewhere, any type of get together that you fixed with another person and they just flat out vanish. No apology, no text, no call, no understanding, no explanation, just gone. And what's worse is they're usually gone forever, like forever, forever, forever. Ever forever ever. You might've exchanged a hundred beautiful texts, you might've been on the phone with one another or video chatted or even met five times and then out of the blue gone.
Speaker 0 54:11 So obviously if someone is behaving this way, they want the other person to understand that they're not interested. But the way you go about it, the way you handle yourself publicly, that's what changes everything. When was the last time you thought about good manners, tact, respect, a code of conduct? Emily post probably never or not since you were a child, which was the last time we had to care think about these things, but in today's world they're more important than ever. If you reject a man in a very cold, cruel way and it makes him angry, not because he's got a temper or because his ego is bruised, but because of the way you did it. Now this man is harboring anger and if enough women do that to him, he's going to carry it around everywhere he goes and think all women are like this or treat women as though they behave like that and treat them worse than he normally would.
Speaker 0 55:06 These are the things we're trying to avoid. To me, these are things that avoid violence. Remember, we've got no idea what to expect when we walk up and approach you, but we have to do it because you won't. It's an important thing to hear. Again, if we want to meet you, we have to approach you and we don't know what's waiting for us. On the other side. Much of what we hear today in the media and beyond about when someone tells us no, is that we're supposed to freeze up, tuck our tail between our legs, feel humiliated and ashamed for asking, turn around and go storming off in the other direction like the Polian dynamite. It's also unspoken but expected that we should vanish and never say another word to this person again, and I'm not exaggerating here, this is especially true if you look at club culture behavior.
Speaker 0 55:54 When a man approaches a woman in a bar or really upscale nightclub where the no just sounds like, Oh now ill get outta here. Excuse me, where my friends and I really don't think that this is the behavior that you would prefer to give us and I certainly don't think that women, you want to make men feel scared of you or fearful of you or fearful of your wrath. I don't think you want to embarrass most men or make us feel guilty or shameful for talking to you when it comes to saying no, something is very clear. You don't want things to continue in the direction that they're going and that's great. Establishing a boundary is critical, but if you are dating someone or you've spent a little bit more time with them and you're interacting with one another and knows come up, what is actually expected.
Speaker 0 56:41 Do you want your male partner to freeze back up, vanish, disappear, sit there like a zombie and say, Oh my gosh, I'm so sorry. Cancel, cancel, let me suck the words back in and try to back peddle out of it or feel bad about it. Or is there room for a conversation and we're going to talk a lot about that in part two of this episode as well. To me, it's far better to be able to explore that subject and actually understand why your partner might be feeling that way. What's up? What's going on with you? How are you feeling? Talk to me. Did my question offend you? Did you get upset by hearing me ask you that? What's, what's on your mind? The answer, no is going to come up all the time, but it doesn't have to be delivered poorly and it doesn't have to be received poorly.
Speaker 0 57:25 So let's say for example, you're sexually interested in someone else and you are the kind of person who does know approaching of any kind. You believe that the person interested in you, if he's really a man or a real person that they should come up to you, they have to approach you and that's going to be the determining factor of whether he's worth it or not. You also know that when we're out and about, we're not wearing name tags with our entire sexual history written on them, no way to know our availability, our status, our vulnerabilities and so forth. So let's say someone musters up the courage to ask you out or approach you and you yourself know that you couldn't or wouldn't do this yourself. If you're able to have a sensitivity to all of the things that had to happen for that one person to make his way to you, don't you think it would be nice to have some sort of sympathy and compassion?
Speaker 0 58:12 If you decide that you're not interested in him, there's no way for one person to know all the things that have made you who you are and have shaped who you are as a person. It takes time and in the beginning stages it's awkward. It's strange. We're doing our best and we're men and women. We don't communicate in the same way. Even women don't communicate in the same way as other women, and I make this point so strongly because if you're the kind of person who lives her life that says, I don't approach and men come to me and only men who are worth it, come to me. If you do that, you're purposely placing yourself into a higher position of power and somebody go ugly declaring that you're the prize. You're suggesting that you're the one who should be claimed or won over or convinced.
Speaker 0 58:56 You're saying, I don't go after what I want. I just wait and hope that the right thing comes to me. You're also saying that my worth is defined by how I look. Ooh, that's a strong one. How can I defend that? What else does someone have to go by? If you haven't said a word to them and you're waiting for him to approach you and all he can see is your chest, your butt, your face, and the way that you're interacting with your friends. It's purely appearance based and last time I checked, women don't want to be objectified as sexual objects or exclusively judged on the way they look. So the person who's able to do that, the one who breaks through and approaches you is generally just the loudest, most of noxious, most I don't care guy in the room, not the one you actually want.
Speaker 0 59:45 In some cases it can even be the pickup artist and this can be one indicator as to why you may be continued to pick bad men. I think there's something so powerful in being the aggressor or the one who pursues, whether you're a man or a woman. It's a very powerful position to be in because it gives you choice. It means that you are doing the selecting and the choosing. So many women believe in fact you might be one of them. Don't you think about yourself that you choose men? Real choice comes from being assertive about it and not just hoping that that person might speak to you. I think, and I wish everyone could get the perfect amount of rejection if they're going to be told no. When you're in a safe space, and this takes practice to be able to reject people at least as sincerely and respectfully as they approached you.
Speaker 0 00:40 When you really understand how much energy it takes and how much strength it requires for person who is it her send you to come over and talk to you, how wonderful is it that you can at least give them the benefit of the doubt? Give them a few moments of your time, assuming it's not the 50th person who approach you today, hear them out and let them down softly, sweetly respectfully, you know, to respond in kind or you might've heard the phrase do unto others as you'd have them do unto you however you need to hear it, but being considerate of the other person's time as well and not just your own using direct language like I'm not interested. I appreciate this, but it's really not for me. I don't want to be romantic with anyone right now. I'm really not interested in pursuing anything.
Speaker 0 01:24 Please stop contacting me. Depending on how strong and severe you have to be, but the tone and delivery to not write someone off like they're disposable or meaningless. Now as I'm recording this, I can't help but hear the voices in my head of other people who are really getting rattled up about agency and they're independent, right? To be able to express themselves however they want to, and don't tell me how I should talk to someone. I'm gonna do me you do you. That's not my responsibility. How someone else reacts to what I say I can be as mean or as cruel as I want. And then however someone else responds, that's on them. That's their choice. Ugh, so closed down. So shutdowns. Yeah. In one regard, it's true. You don't have control about how someone else is going to feel. You don't have control over someone else's response or reaction to what you say.
Speaker 0 02:13 And technically speaking, you don't owe anyone anything but you're not going to get very far. Having relationships like this you, we are too interpersonal. We depend too much on one another and so we all want to feel connection and we all want to feel closer to the people that we are attracted to. Why not do things that make it easier for that to happen? Because all of that verbiage will do wonders to give people a tougher skin, but it does absolutely nothing to bring us closer. All right, I think that's an excellent spot to bring part one to a close coming soon. Of course we'll have part two of how to say no. I hope this has really given you the ability to think of the consequences of what saying no does and how you go about doing it, how you go about receiving it. Now also hope this has given you a lot more compassion toward the opposite sex when someone is approaching you. Thank you for listening. We hope you've enjoyed this immensely. To get coaching, please visit our website, www.getcloseness.com and if you feel so inspired, please consider donating to our
[email protected] forward slash closeness. Thank you and have a wonderful day.
